There has been discussion lately about splitting up the leaderboard due to version differences. There are three distinct versions of this, and the notable differences are as follows (please correct me if these are incorrect):

• US-PRG1 (Black Label/White-Green Title Screen): The Border Raid is Scene 3. This version of the stage has slow rolling, fast cursor/aim, cursor disappears while rolling and bottles are worth 4% evidence. The Railway Station has slow movement.
• Famicom: The Border Raid is also Scene 3. This version of the stage has fast rolling, fast cursor, cursor disappears while rolling and bottles are worth 4% evidence. The Railway Station has fast movement.
• US-PRG2 (Blue Label/Blue Title Screen): The Border Raid is now Scene 2. This version of the stage has slow rolling, slow cursor/aim, cursor remains active while rolling and bottles are worth 5% evidence. The Railway Station has fast movement.

These seems to be enough gameplay differences to warrant splitting the board. The only downside I see is that the board is already small as it is, so splitting it up is not ideal. That being said, it still probably makes sense to make a separate category for each version.

This open for discussion before I make any changes to the leaderboard, and I appreciate any feedback.

Hi there, I'd be happy to moderate the board. I know the game well, mod several other games and am very familiar with frame counting. I am also very active on the site. Also, thank you for posting about this and not just abandoning the board outright.

Updates have been made. Ended up just including milliseconds for sub 1:55 on Baby Moses and sub 2:05 for David & Goliath. Thanks for the reply sorok_a, I appreciate it.

xChristine made a thread about this back in 2021, and I would like to expand on this topic a bit. Original post was "I was wondering if we should add milliseconds for all Baby Moses runs that are Sub2 or Sub1:55. Also, we should maybe have timer start/stop rules."

First of all, it looks like timing rules were established at some point since then. Rules state "Timer starts on character control. Timer stops when you lose character control at the end of the last stage with Baby Moses in hand." However, there are discrepancies in how runs are timed. It seems that submissions from the last four years follow the same timing method based on the current rules, where time starts on the first frame that your character can move (also same frame that baby Moses's arms are first raised) and time ends on the frame that your character can no longer move. Most of the older submissions seem to use a timing method that starts when the first stage appears and ends when the final stage fades to black.

I would like to retime all runs using the current rules, since that seems to be how runs have been timed for the past few years, including the top five times. I would also like to set a threshold for times to include milliseconds. At minimum, it should probably be anything below 1:55 for Baby Moses (although sub 2:00 would also work as a nice even number). Updated times would look like this:

• ScottyJ47 01:51.550
• xChristine 01:52.017
• sorok_a 01:52.050
• authorblues 01:52.233
• stalwartturtle 01:52.767
• flower 01:52.783
• brossentia 01:52.933
• 8BitsOfJoy 01:53.450
• ThorOfKenya 01:54.317
• MiphaRivia 01:54.883
• Cactuar 01:55 (.417)
• skateman222 01:57 (.067)
• BubblesDelFuego 01:58 (.733)
• RantronBomb 01:58 (.733)
• Neetsel 01:59 (.300)
• fulgore 02:00
• TheElderSpark 02:00
• ebloodycandy 02:04
• RainingEndavor 02:08
• TheFinalSentinel 02:15
• busterkuri 02:41
• RoboYetiX 02:47
• erika_RTA 02:54
• SirUseless 05:42
• NihilistComedy 06:31
• GreenBomber 12:42

I would also like to establish timing rules for David and Goliath, since there are none. The top runs appear to use the same timing method, where time starts on the first frame that your character can move (also the first frame that health/scripture meter appears) and time ends when screen goes black after defeating Goliath. I would also like to set a similar threshold for milliseconds in this category. Probably anything below 2:05 would make the most sense here. Updated times would look like this:

• sorok_a 01:59.150
• ScottyJ47 02:01.367
• authorblues 02:04.467
• garadas21 02:07
• MythicDeo 06:17? Missing Video
• GreenBomber 44:38

If anyone has feedback, please respond, I would like input from the community. I will leave this thread open for a few weeks before any changes are made.

I have made an update to the timing rules. Time now begins on the first frame that the map screen appears. The rule was to start when selecting your character, but I've found that is not easy to determine (requires calculating frames from a visual cue). All runs have been retimed accordingly, with most times having very little or no change.

Currently, the rules for the Any% category of this game use vague terminology for how timing should end: "Timing ends as soon as you jump and reach the doomsday tomato." I have done a full retiming of every run on the board (not updated yet) and there seems to be inconsistencies with how different moderators over the years have timed runs. This is most likely due to how the timing rules are written.

I would like to change the end timing to something more clear and, in my opinion, less arbitrary. I feel like the most logical choice is to have time end when the screen goes black after losing character control (black screen before the screen with the "doomsday tomato"). This seems like a clear visual cue and shouldn't cause anymore confusion.

Here is an example of what the updated times would look like:

Spyriel... 04:05.200 -> 03:59.500

8BitsOfJoy... 04:06.250 -> 04:00.617

WhiteHat94... 04:08.960 -> 04:03.250

xcd... 04:09.xxx -> 04:04.083

Pretty much every run on the board would lowered by 5-6 seconds, and I have it all retimed on a spreadsheet already so I can update everything quickly.

I will leave this thread open for a few weeks so that I can get feedback.

Maybe I'm missing something, but I'm pretty sure this is a Switch exclusive and definitely not playable on NES. The only submission I see with NES selected as the platform is Magicallyy's recent 10:43 in Party Mode - Ultimate Speedrun, but looking at it you can see it is obviously on played on Switch.

I recently became the moderator for this board and noticed that there were no rules, so I went ahead and added a basic ruleset.

I also decided to adjust the timing method a bit. Based on authorblues' existing runs, timing seemed to end on first textbox appearing at the door room. I felt it better to push it back to when the final textbox disappears in the treasure room, since that is when the final required input is made before the end screen. Time can be saved in this final segment by jumping towards the door right before the first text appears, since it cuts down on the slow automatic walking animation that occurs before the door opens. Time can also be saved obviously by mashing to advance the text.

No need to apologize for anything! You are doing good work as usual. Please ignore my poor attempt at humor.

Hey there, I'm not thinking of running this game and noticed the non-existent WR is using non-Turbo to not shoot while not walking backwards. Is that not allowed on this board? I did not see anything in the non-existent rules about it and did not want to make sure before not practicing no more. Thanks (NOT) (well maybe yes)! <3

Hey CubbyCat. Sorry about the really late response. Somehow I never saw a notification for this. As far as the compilation cart, I think it is probably best to not allow it for the same reasons as the ABC board (differences in the menu which is part of how runs are timed; possible other differences with RNG).

The leaderboard is for full game runs, which requires both Astro-Grover and Ernie's Magic Shapes in the same run.

Oh and the most important thing. Always hold B to run in this game. Even before you gain the ability to run in the later stages, always hold B while jumping. You will instantly save a ton of time. :)

It is just a matter of timing the jump. The window of opportunity is pretty tight (maybe a couple of frames) if you are holding forward on the d-pad. However, it is possible to stop and line up on specific pixels, the proceed with the jump with minimal time loss. Look at Nontimetis's current PB to see what the visual cues would be.

As far as the zappy tomato, you typically don't have to worry about it if you make those jumps.

Yes it should be its own separate board. Someone will need to request it from the Support Hub. I personally have no interest in running a 20+ minute long Sesame Street game, but I could record a run just to get the request placed. I think the question is, who wants to be in charge of the compilation board?

Just a reminder for everyone that the rules were expanded last month to include some points that I thought were important. Things like game audio needing to be reasonably clear, and resetting between attempts, are standard practice for a lot of NES games, but are sometimes overlooked when recording attempts. These help determine authenticity of runs, and resetting in particular affects RNG. I also added a specific list of accepted emulators that should be used, and these are generally accepted for a lot of NES games. My personal recommendation for emulator is MesenRTA, but they are all reasonably good. Timing has also been elaborated on a little further, but the main difference is that there is no longer a set order for completing mini games. If you want to start with Ernie's Big Splash games first, go for it.

As of today, the Sesame Street ABC & 123 compilation is no longer accepted on this board, as was discussed in another thread.

When going through various runs on the board, I noticed that there was some slight inconsistency in how people were timing runs. I've gone ahead and retimed everyone's runs according to the rules. Runs on the No Cutscenes category were left as is, since the rules are odd compared to the rest of the leaderboard and the times are fairly spread out anyways. It did not seem urgent to frame count these runs yet.

Perhaps in the future, there could be a solution to convert those No Cutscenes times to be comparable to Any%, such as calculating the missing animation time and adding it to the run time. That way, the existing No Cutscenes times can be merged into Any% and all future runs would follow Any% rules. This is just me thinking out loud at the moment, but it may become a separate proposal to be discussed in the future.

Thanks for reading everyone. Now go learn your ABC's. :)

It has been a couple of weeks since this topic started, and it seems like the general opinion is that the ABC & 123 compilation should be treated as a separate game.

The game rules have been updated with "This leaderboard is for the Sesame Street ABC standalone game. The Sesame Street ABC & 123 compilation is not allowed." I will add a note in the description of zxKyler's submissions that this version of the game is no longer allowed as of 10/23/2023, but their runs will remain on the board since they were submitted long before this topic came up.

Thanks for making these updates to the rules. It always seemed like there needed to be these types of clear visual frames in how timing should be done.

I actually offered to help with moderation in the past, mainly because of this reason, so I'm glad to see a new mod has come in to organize the leaderboard.